Change is not a destination, just as hope is not a strategy.

Host: The room was bathed in a soft glow, the evening light slowly fading as Jack sat at the desk, deep in thought. He was reading something on his phone, his brow furrowed slightly, before his gaze lifted and met Jeeny’s.

Jeeny: (gently) “You look like you’re reflecting on something. What’s on your mind?”

Jack: (looking up, with a thoughtful smile) “I just came across a quote by Rudy Giuliani: ‘Change is not a destination, just as hope is not a strategy.’ It got me thinking about how we often talk about change or hope as if they’re the end goal when they’re really just part of the process. Change is constant, but it’s what we do with it that matters.”

Host: Jeeny tilts her head slightly, considering the quote. The stillness of the room deepens as she processes the meaning behind it.

Jeeny: “It’s so true. We tend to treat change like it's the finish line, as if once it happens, everything falls into place. But it’s not the end. It’s just part of the journey, and we have to keep moving forward, adjusting, adapting. Same with hope — hoping for something to happen without any real plan or action doesn’t get us anywhere. It’s just the starting point.”

Jack: (nodding) “Exactly. It’s easy to get caught up in the idea that change or hope will automatically lead to success, but without taking intentional steps, it’s just a concept. Hope doesn’t drive us forward — it’s the action we take based on that hope that shapes the outcome. Change requires effort, not just wishing for things to be different.”

Host: Jeeny smiles softly, her eyes reflecting a quiet understanding as she thinks about the importance of taking action in the face of change. The room feels a little more intimate now, as if they’ve uncovered something important together.

Jeeny: “I think it’s about ownership of the change, too. When we expect change to just happen on its own, we’re not actively engaging with it. But when we recognize that it’s a constant part of life and take responsibility for how we adapt, that’s when we can make real progress.”

Jack: (softly) “Yeah, it’s not just about hoping things get better. It’s about understanding that we have to take charge of how things evolve. Change requires us to be active participants, to shape it with intention.”

Host: The room settles into a peaceful silence, the realization that change and hope are not static destinations but dynamic processes. Both require action, engagement, and constant effort to move forward. Rudy Giuliani’s words serve as a reminder that it’s not enough to simply hope for change — we must actively embrace it and shape it through our choices.